CNN anchor Jake Tapper and Dr. Sanjay Gupta, the network's top medical correspondent, agreed Monday the method being used by the government to report COVID-19 hospitalizations is explicitly "misleading."
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which manages COVID data reporting, does not distinguish between people hospitalized for COVID (meaning complications from the virus caused them to be hospitalized) or people hospitalized with COVID (meaning people who test positive for COVID after being admitted for reasons unrelated to the virus).
CDC Director Rochelle Walensky was confronted Sunday on whether she could break down "for COVID" numbers versus "with COVID" numbers regarding reported COVID deaths in the United States. Unfortunately, she could not, but promised such data would be forthcoming.
New York Gov. Kathy Hochul (D) released data last week showing that 43% of COVID hospitalizations in the Empire State at the time were people hospitalized "with COVID." In New York City specifically, that number jumped to 51%, meaning more people were hospitalized for reasons not related to COVID but then tested positive for COVID after being admitted.
Discussing the data from New York, Tapper pointed out the obvious: COVID hospitalizations are likely inflated, and are therefore "misleading," if the CDC includes those hospitalized "for COVID" and "with COVID" in the same data set.
"So, the hospitals are still stretched thin because of this, so I’m not trying to take away from that, but if 40% in some hospitals, 40% of the people with COVID don’t necessarily have problematic COVID — they’re there because they got into a car accident, they’re there because, you know, they bumped their head — and they’re being included as in the hospital with COVID, that number seems kind of misleading," Tapper observed.
Surprisingly, Gupta agreed and called for increased transparency from the government.
"Yeah, I agree, Jake. It surprises me that they have not been able to parse out that data more carefully," Gupta said. "There needs to be transparency about that, in terms of 'for or with COVID.'"
Gupta added that all states should follow New York's lead, especially considering public health officials there have learned how to properly delineate data.
"Yeah, we’re two years into this and we need the clearest picture possible," Tapper agreed. "If somebody’s in the hospital with a broken leg and they also have asymptomatic COVID, that should not count as being hospitalized with COVID, clearly."
CNN's Jake Tapper rips into "misleading" COVID hospitalization numbers.\n"We're 2 years into this ... if somebody's in the hospital with a broken leg and they also have asymptomatic COVID, that should not be counted as hospitalized with covid, clearly."pic.twitter.com/rZhcANyYaW— Nicholas Fondacaro (@Nicholas Fondacaro) 1641849327
Joe Rogan fired back at Don Lemon after the CNN anchor doubled down on the false narrative that the podcast giant took "horse dewormer" to treat COVID-19.
Rogan announced on Sept. 1 that he fell ill with COVID-19, but rebounded from the respiratory disease within a few days. Rogan said he "threw the kitchen sink at it," which included treatments of monoclonal antibodies, ivermectin, Z-Pak, and prednisone. Rogan pointed out that he was prescribed these treatments by a doctor.
The media zeroed in on Rogan's use of ivermectin, an anti-parasitic medication that is is listed on the World Health Organization's "essential medicines list." There have reportedly been 3.7 billion ivermectin doses distributed globally in the past 30 years to treat parasitic infections in humans. The Food and Drug Administration acknowledges that there is a human version of ivermectin and one designated for animals, but does not recommend the use of either to treat COVID-19.
Despite knowing that ivermectin is a drug made for humans, the media pushed a narrative that Rogan was taking a "horse dewormer," "horse paste," and a "livestock drug." Grabien created a compilation of the media attempting to discredit Rogan by saying the podcast giant was taking a "horse dewormer."
SUPERCUT!Media mock @JoeRogan for claim they invented about horse pills https://t.co/D5CuBEKgBw
— Tom Elliott (@tomselliott) 1634300188.0
CNN was one of the mainstream media networks that repeatedly asserted Rogan was taking "horse dewormer." So much so that Rogan openly contemplated suing the network for lying about his treatment with a doctor-prescribed medication for humans.
"They keep saying I'm taking horse dewormer," Rogan said last month. "I literally got it from a doctor. It's an American company. They won the Nobel Prize in 2015 for use in human beings and CNN is saying I'm taking horse dewormer. They must know that's a lie."
CNN contributor Mary Katharine Ham slammed her own employer for its "dishonest" reporting on Rogan's COVID-19 treatment.
"Rogan is right that it's dishonest to say he took horse dewormer when he did not. It was irresistible to dunk on him for a lot of people, so they went with that instead of sticking to 'hey, this anti-parasitic isn't recommended for COVID treatment,' which would've been credible," Ham said.
Despite CNN besmirching him on multiple occasions on various TV programs on the network, Rogan welcomed CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta on the massively popular "The Joe Rogan Experience."
During the mostly friendly three-hour podcast episode, Rogan confronted Gupta on why his network is "lying" about him taking horse dewormer.
"They're lying at your network about people taking human drugs versus drugs for veterinary," Rogan told Gupta.
"It's a lie. It's a lie on a news network … and it's a lie that they're conscious of. It's not a mistake," Rogan ripped CNN. "They're unfavorably framing it as veterinary medicine."
Gupta finally admitted, "They shouldn't have said that."
Days after Gupta's appearance on "The Joe Rogan Experience," he appeared on CNN's "Don Lemon Tonight" show. Lemon doubled down on the narrative that Rogan was taking "horse dewormer."
"[Rogan] did say something about ivermectin that I think wasn't actually correct about CNN and lying," Lemon told Gupta. "Ivermectin is a drug that is commonly used as a horse dewormer. So, it is not a lie to say that the drug is used as a horse dewormer. I think that's important. And it is not approved for COVID. Correct?"
Gupta replied, "That's right. That's correct. It is not approved for COVID. And, you're right. I mean, the FDA even put out a statement ... that said, 'You're not a horse, you're not a cow, stop taking this stuff'" in reference to ivermectin.
Rogan roared back at Lemon and CNN for continuing to falsely claim that he took veterinary medicine. During an interview this week with cultural commentator Michael Malice on "The Joe Rogan Experience," the podcast king bashed Lemon as a "dumb motherf*****."
"This is what's so funny about that. They don't understand that when they say things that are absolutely untrue, it diminishes their authority. They're not even aware of what they're doing," Rogan said of CNN. "When Don Lemon goes on with Sanjay Gupta and says, 'Actually, it really is a veterinary medicine. It really is horse dewormer.'"
"This was the lie- he goes, 'It's not a lie to say it's also used as horse medicine.' But that's not what you said," Malice added. "You didn't you say, 'This drug, which also is used for horses.' Of what relevance is that?"
"It doesn't have any relevance," Rogan replied. "It's exactly what you're talking about with penicillin and with a gigantic number of medicines that also have veterinary applications. But by doing that, you just, you just proved my point."
"They don't even understand what they just did. You think no one's, like, it's going to end with you? Because it used to be that way. They would say something and no one would have recourse. But when you're saying something, and then the person you're saying it about has literally tens times the audience you do, you dumb motherf*****. Do you know what you did? You just proved my point," Rogan added.
Fox News reported this week, "Don Lemon continues to suffer in the 10 pm ET primetime slot, averaging just 619,000 viewers two weeks into October, a 15% drop from his 724,000 average last month."
Meanwhile, Rogan reportedly received 190 million monthly downloads in 2019, with approximately 15 episodes a month.
Rogan then gave some advice to CNN president Jeff Zucker, who Rogan said he likes and knows him from when he hosted "Fear Factor" and Zucker was the head of NBC at the time.
"They need better people. They need people that are respected because it's not that CNN is beyond repair," Rogan claimed. "Look, I know Jeff Zucker… He's a nice guy… He's a great guy. It's just there, it's like everything else, these people are managing at scale. And but you can't allow people to say things that are absolutely untrue when you have a f***ing news organization."
CNN issued a statement on the row with Rogan to Washington Post media critic Erik Wemple this week, and defended saying the stand-up comedian was taking medicine for livestock.
"The issue is that a powerful voice in the media, who by example and through his platform, sowed doubt in the proven and approved science of vaccines while promoting the use of an unproven treatment for covid-19 — a drug developed to ward off parasites in farm animals," the cable TV network stated. "The only thing CNN did wrong here was bruise the ego of a popular podcaster who pushed dangerous conspiracy theories and risked the lives of millions of people in doing so."
Rogan responded to CNN's statement on his podcast, "And it's not about my feelings… I like it when my feelings get hurt. How about that? I like it. I hurt my own feelings. Like there's not a f***ing human being that's a worse critic of me than me, alright? That's not what the problem is."
Joe Rogan responds to Don Lemon Doubling Down with Sanjay Gupta www.youtube.com
CNN contributor Mary Katharine Ham torched her own employer Friday for its "dishonest" reporting on Joe Rogan and ivermectin.
When Rogan announced last month that he had tested positive for COVID-19 — and was subsequently prescribed ivermectin — CNN dishonestly claimed that Rogan was taking "horse dewormer."
Rogan, of course, was not ingesting the form of ivermectin made for animals, but the form of ivermectin produced for human ingestion. Although the media had reduced ivermectin to a mere "horse dewormer," ivermectin was awarded a Nobel Peace Prize in 2015 for its "immeasurable" benefits to humans.
Rogan made headlines this week after interviewing CNN chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. During the interview, Rogan forced Gupta to admit that CNN "shouldn't have said that," referring to the dishonest framing that claimed Rogan ingested a "horse dewormer."
Writing on social media, Ham affirmed Rogan's criticisms, explaining CNN decided to "dunk" on Rogan instead of providing viewers with accurate coverage about Rogan's bout with COVID-19.
"Rogan is right that it's dishonest to say he took horse dewormer when he did not. It was irresistible to dunk on him for a lot of people, so they went with that instead of sticking to 'hey, this anti-parasitic isn't recommended for COVID treatment,' which would've been credible," Ham said.
Rogan is right that it’s dishonest to say he took horse dewormer when he did not. It was irresistible to dunk on hi… https://t.co/O6omDmkbFz
— Mary Katharine Ham (@mkhammer) 1634307540.0
In a follow up, Ham ratcheted up her criticism, describing CNN's "horse dewormer" framing as "horses**t."
"Agreed, I'm not looking to explicate the entire Ivermectin fight in one tweet. That was shorthand for a pronouncement that would have been more suitable than he's taking horse dewormer,' which is just straight, well, horses**t. I'm happy for folks to take it safely & half expect," she said.
Gupta seemingly backtracked on his admission during an interview with CNN host Don Lemon on Thursday.
During that interview, Lemon doubled down on CNN's lie, saying, "It is not a lie to say that [Ivermectin] is used as a horse dewormer. I think that's important. And it is not approved for COVID." Gupta responded, "Correct, that is correct and it is not approved for COVID."
In fact, a range of CNN hosts and personalities advanced the lie that Rogan took medication meant for animals. They did not simply note, as Lemon claimed, that ivermectin "is used as a horse dewormer." Honest reporting would have differentiated between what Rogan took — not animal medication — and the version of ivermectin made for animals.
Rogan has floated suing CNN for "making s**t up."
Interestingly, Gupta later published an essay explaining why he appeared on Rogan's podcast. Gupta said he did so to convince Rogan to get vaccinated against COVID-19. Rogan, however, has natural immunity against COVID-19 because of his infection this summer.
The video of podcaster Joe Rogan taking to task CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta over his network's "lie" that Rogan took "horse de-wormer" to battle his COVID-19 infection — when, in fact, his ivermectin was prescribed by a doctor — is pretty stunning to watch.
As most folks still willing to embrace the truth know by now, there's ivermectin for animals and ivermectin for humans. And no, humans shouldn't take the ivermectin for animals.
"Do you think that that's a problem that your news network lies?" Rogan asked Gupta. "First of all it was prescribed to me by a doctor."
"Yeah, they shouldn't have said that," Gupta replied "If you got a human pill — because there were people that were taking the veterinary medication, and you're not obviously; you got it from a doctor, so it shouldn't be called that."
Gupta then tried to change the subject, but Rogan wouldn't let him off the hook just yet.
"Does it bother you that the news network you work for out and out lied?" Rogan asked him. "Just outright lied about me taking horse de-wormer?"
Gupta confessed again: "They shouldn't have said that."
"Why did they do that?" Rogan asked.
"I don't know," Gupta answered.
"You didn't ask?" Rogan replied incredulously. "You're the medical guy over there."
"I didn't ask," Gupta responded contritely. "I should have asked before coming on your podcast."
Joe Rogan asks Sanjay Gupta if it bothers him that CNN outright lied about Rogan taking horse dewormer to recover f… https://t.co/1nvKUS3wES
— Clay Travis (@ClayTravis) 1634179170.0
Wow! Could that mean we might actually be getting somewhere with embracing facts, ending spin, and conducting proper journalism?
Apparently no.
Because Gupta appeared on Don Lemon's CNN show later Wednesday, and the pair proceeded to completely gloss over the network's assertion that Rogan took horse de-wormer and ignored the fact that Rogan got a doctor's ivermectin prescription for human consumption.
"[Rogan] did say something about ivermectin that I think wasn't actually correct about CNN and lying," Lemon told Gupta, adding that "ivermectin is a drug that is commonly used as a horse de-wormer. So, it is not a lie to say that the drug is used as a horse de-wormer. I think that's important. And it is not approved for COVID. Correct?"
Gupta replied, "That's right. That's correct. It is not approved for COVID. And, you're right. I mean, the FDA even put out a statement ... that said 'you're not a horse, you're not a cow, stop taking this stuff'" in reference to ivermectin.
The doctor continued, saying "now I think what Joe's point is" before Lemon cut him off — perhaps Gupta was about to bring up the fact that Rogan took ivermectin for humans. But we'll never know.
"It's been approved for humans but not necessarily for COVID, right?" Lemon said, failing to clarify that Rogan actually did take the proper prescription as opposed to the one for animals.
"That's correct," Gupta replied. "It's been used for a parasitic disease for something called river blindness, and it's been very effective for that. But, you know, just because it works for one thing doesn't mean it works for something else. And there are still a few ongoing clinical trials around ivermectin. But for the most part, if you look at the data, there's no evidence that it really works here."
He continued saying that when Rogan "got sick, he took ivermectin." Again, no mention that it was properly prescribed by a doctor. Gupta added that "he also took monoclonal antibodies, which is, you know, an infusion of these antibodies. So, he took both those things. It's very likely it was the monoclonal antibodies that made him feel better so quickly."
"I will talk to them," @DrSanjayGupta told @JoeRogan after Gupta said on the podcast that it was wrong for CNN to d… https://t.co/41iCUZ4jE7
— Steve Krakauer (@SteveKrak) 1634237432.0
CNN talking heads could legitimately argue all day long that the FDA has discouraged ivermectin use to treat COVID-19 — that's factual. They could legitimately argue some humans are taking it improperly — that's factual.
But saying Rogan used horse de-wormer isn't factual. When a human is medically prescribed ivermectin, it's for humans, not horses or other animals. But CNN indeed downplayed that last month, as Anderson Cooper — on top of a headline reading, "Joe Rogan announces he has COVID; praises horse dewormer ivermectin" — said the drug is "more often used to de-worm horses."
CNN's chief media correspondent Brian Stelter echoed that spin: "But when you have a horse de-worming medication that's discouraged by the government that actually causes some people in this crazed environment we're in to actually want to try it, that's the upside-down world we're in with figures like Joe Rogan."
At least the physician on the panel, Dr. Leana Wen, admitted that ivermectin can be prescribed for humans — but again, no clarifying words that Rogan received the medication properly.
Joe Rogan says he tested positive for Covid-19youtu.be
All of which might explain why Rogan also told Gupta during his podcast, "My point is you're working for a news organization. If they're lying about a comedian taking horse medication, what are they telling us about Russia? What are they telling us about Syria? Do you understand that that's why people get concerned about the veracity of the news?"
There was a tense exchange between Joe Rogan and CNN's chief medical correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta. The massively popular podcast host confronted Gupta about CNN's lying about Rogan using "horse dewormer" after falling ill with coronavirus.
Last month, Rogan announced that he contracted COVID-19. The stand-up comedian said he "threw the kitchen sink" at the respiratory disease – including monoclonal antibodies and the controversial anti-parasite drug ivermectin. Rogan skewered CNN for the network's repeated claims that the UFC color commentator was using "horse dewormer" and even floated the idea of suing the cable news network for falsely saying that he was taking a veterinary medicine and not the human version.
In the most recent episode of "The Joe Rogan Experience," the podcast host grilled Gupta about CNN's lies about him using "horse dewormer."
Gupta told Rogan, "By the way, I'm glad you're better."
"Thank you," Rogan responded. "You're probably the only one at CNN who's glad. The rest of them are all lying about me taking horse medication."
"That bothered you," Gupta said while grinning.
"It should bother you too," Rogan fired back. "They're lying at your network about people taking human drugs versus drugs for veterinary."
Gupta admitted, "Calling it a 'horse dewormer' is not a flattering thing, I get that."
"It's a lie. It's a lie on a news network … and it's a lie that they're conscious of. It's not a mistake," Rogan said, noting that ivermectin was prescribed to him by a doctor. "They're unfavorably framing it as veterinary medicine."
Gupta attempted to justify CNN's misclassification by referencing a "snarky" statement released by the Food and Drug Administration about ivermectin that said: "You are not a horse. You are not a cow."
Rogan asked, "Why would you say that when you are talking about a drug that's been given out to billions and billions of people?"
"A drug that one of the inventors won a Nobel Prize in 2015," Rogan noted.
"A drug that has been shown to stop viral replication in vitro. ... Why would they lie and say that's horse dewormer? I can afford people medicine, motherf***er. This is ridiculous! It's just a lie!"
Rogan said CNN host Brian Stelter was "gleeful" over Rogan's positive COVID-19 diagnosis. Rogan slammed CNN for not reporting that he tested negative for COVID-19 "five days later" and "felt great" following his treatment.
He continued to question CNN's chief medical correspondent, "Don't you think that a lie like that is dangerous on a news network when you know that they know they're lying? ... Do you think that that's a problem that your news network lies?"
Rogan challenged Gupta, "My point is you're working for a news organization. If they're lying about a comedian taking horse medication, what are they telling us about Russia? What are they telling us about Syria? Do you understand that that's why people get concerned about the veracity of the news?"
Gupta finally confessed, "They shouldn't have said that." Gupta said he "didn't know" why the network spread the "horse dewormer" lie.
Joe Rogan asks Sanjay Gupta if it bothers him that CNN outright lied about Rogan taking horse dewormer to recover f… https://t.co/1nvKUS3wES
— Clay Travis (@ClayTravis) 1634179170.0
Rogan also confronted Gupta on the neurosurgeon's recommendation that children get vaccinated.
.@joerogan challenges TV doctor @drsanjaygupta on forcing children to get vaccinated.It's as if it's the first ti… https://t.co/7s7d2u3yIM
— Young Americans for Liberty (@YALiberty) 1634160600.0
Rogan also pressed Gupta about the possibility of the Wuhan lab-leak theory in relation to gain-of-function research funded by the National Institutes of Health.
The Questions Around Gain of Function Research www.youtube.com
Following the release of the interview on Spotify, Gupta called "The Joe Rogan Experience" – which is one of the world's most popular podcasts with over 200 million monthly downloads in 2019 – a "lion's den."
"I realized that if I was serious about trying to communicate public health, I needed to go to a less comfortable place," Gupta explained.
"I walked into the lion's den and spoke with @joerogan on his podcast for more than 3 hours — vaccines, ivermectin, and much more. Friends tried to get me to turn down his invite, but ultimately I'm glad I did it," Gupta said.
"When I told Joe early in the podcast that I didn't agree with his apparent views on vaccines against Covid, ivermectin and many things in between, part of me thought the MMA, former Taekwondo champion might hurtle himself across the table and throttle my neck," Gupta said of Rogan. "But, instead he smiled, and off we went."
You can watch the entire "Joe Rogan Experience" episode with Sanjay Gupta below.
Biden's doctor also allegedly had business dealings with the president’s brother, James Biden, as well as Hunter Biden and the president of a hospital being acquired by Americore, a now-bankrupt hospital chain accused of massive Medicare fraud.
There is no convincing me that any single Covid-related death or infection resulted in legitimate sorrow at CNN, MSNBC or The New York Times.
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